Workshop repair help

Has anyone served in the Army that has worked on the "Shop Equipment Electronic Repair General Purpose T.C.T.M. 3Ton CB.365/1?

I need some help regarding the electrics in my box body. There are internal batteries, air con X2, heater, NBC filtration, and all manner of plug sockets. I want to be able to plug it in to either a generator or mains so the lights and plug sockets work. There is a reel drum with electrical cable on and a socket at each end. Do you know if one end of this is for the genny and the other that plugs into the box? Any help will be much appreciated.

Thanks

Andy

Andy, I'll have a look, as time permits, if there are any clues in these. I have this in EMER WHEELED VEHICLES:

C 039 Transportable Container, 3 Ton, Truck Mounted. Transfer of EMERs to AESPs. Misc.Instr.No.10. Jun.1982

C 037/1 Signals, Transportable Container, Truck Mounting, 3 ton. Penthouse. Mod.Instr.No.1. Mar.1970

C 037/1 Signals, Transportable Container, Truck Mounting, 3 ton. Door grab handles. Mod.Instr.No.2. Jun.1972

C 037/1 Signals, Transportable Container, Truck Mounting, 3 ton. Warning plate – body mountings. Mod.Instr.No.3. Aug.1974

C 030/5 Refrigerated Transportable Container, Truck Mounted. Data Summary. Dec.1970

C 037/6 Transportable Container, 3 Ton, Truck Mounted. Mod.Instr.No. 1, 4, 5.

C 037/8 Transportable Container, 3 Ton, Truck Mounted. Mod.Instr.No.2. Nov.1981

C 030/9 Shop, Equipment, Instrument Repair, TC, CB 368. Data Summary. Aug.1976

C 031/9 Shop, Equipment, Instrument Repair, TC, CB 368. Operator’s Instructions. Jan.1977

C 032/9 Shop, Equipment, Instrument Repair, TC, CB 368. Field & Base Repairs. Jul.1977

C 038/9 Shop, Equipment, Instrument Repair, TC, CB 368. Part 2. Inspection Standard. Oct.1977

C 037/12 Transportable Container, 3 Ton Truck, Mounted, CB 362, ERV Rapier. Mod.Instr.No.1,2,3,4.

C 037/13 Transportable Container, 3 Ton Truck, Mounted, CB 363,Rapier HORV. Mod.Instr.No.2. May 1976

C 030/15 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 361. Data Summary. Jan.1982

C 031/15 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 361. Operating Instructions. Jun.1982

C 035/15 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 361/0. Inst.Instr.No.1,2,3,4.

C 037/15 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 361. Mod.Instr.No.1,2,3,5,6,7,8.

C 039/15 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 361. Misc.Instr.No. 1.Apr.1982

C 039/21 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 365/2. Misc.Instr.No.1. Apr.1982

C 030/21 Electronic Shop, Control Equipment, Electrical Repair, Truck Mounted, CB365/3. Data summary. Feb.1976

C 038/21 Electronic Shop, Control Equipment, Electrical Repair, Truck Mounted, CB365/3. Part 2. Inspection Standard. Sep.1977

C 039/21 Electronic Shop, Control Equipment, Electrical Repair, Truck Mounted, CB365/3. Misc.Instr.No.1

C 039/23 Shop Equipment, Electronic Repair, Truck Mounted, CB365/5. Misc.Instr.No.1.Apr.1982

C 037/24 Transportable Container, 3 Ton , Truck Mounting, CB370 AIV, AMETS. Mod.Instr.No.1. Aug.1980.

C 037/24 Transportable Container, 3 Ton , Truck Mounting, CB370 AIV, AMETS. Mod.Instr.No.1,2,3,4,5,6,7,9.

C 039/24 Transportable Container, 3 Ton , Truck Mounting, CB370 AIV, AMETS. Misc.Instr.No.2. Sep.1980.

C 037/25 Transportable Container, 3 Ton , Truck Mounting, CB370 AIV, AMETS. Mod.Instr.No.1,2,3,4,5,6.

C 037/30 Transportable Container, 3 Ton , Truck Mounting, CB305 Mk2 (Signals). Mod.Instr.No.1 Nov.1978

and in FAESP:

2510-C-030-101 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Purpose & Planning Information. Nov.1990

2510-C-030-201 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Operating Information, Nov.1990

2510-C-030-522 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Repair Instructions Chaps 1 to 4.1. Nov.1989

2510-C-030-522 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Repair Instructions Chaps 6-1 to 6-5 & Chap 13. Nov.1989

2510-C-030-532 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Inspection Standard Part 1. Jun.1990

2510-C-030-601 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Maintenance Schedule. Mar 1990

2510-C-030-711 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Illustrated Parts Catalogue Chap 1 to 2.2. Jan.1991

2510-C-030-711 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Illustrated Parts Catalogue Chap 2.3 to 4. Jan.1991

2510-C-030-811 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Mod Instrs 23 to 34. Apr.1991

2510-C-030-811 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Mod Instrs 35 to 44. May 1991

2510-C-030-811 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Mod Instrs 45 to 47. Feb.1991

2510-C-030-821 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Gen Instrs & Index. Instrs 1 to 16. Nov.1988

2510-C-030-821 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Gen Instr 17. Mar.1990

2510-C-030-821 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Gen Instrs 23 to end. Feb.1988

Can you post some photos of the connectors and any electrical controls. It should be squaddie-proof, so as long as we can identify the parts I cant see it being a difficult job, although you may want to get it checked by an electrical engineer to check for any hazards.

Andy, I'll have a look, as time permits, if there are any clues in these. I have this in EMER WHEELED VEHICLES:

 

C 039 Transportable Container, 3 Ton, Truck Mounted. Transfer of EMERs to AESPs. Misc.Instr.No.10. Jun.1982

C 037/1 Signals, Transportable Container, Truck Mounting, 3 ton. Penthouse. Mod.Instr.No.1. Mar.1970

C 037/1 Signals, Transportable Container, Truck Mounting, 3 ton. Door grab handles. Mod.Instr.No.2. Jun.1972

C 037/1 Signals, Transportable Container, Truck Mounting, 3 ton. Warning plate – body mountings. Mod.Instr.No.3. Aug.1974

C 030/5 Refrigerated Transportable Container, Truck Mounted. Data Summary. Dec.1970

C 037/6 Transportable Container, 3 Ton, Truck Mounted. Mod.Instr.No. 1, 4, 5.

C 037/8 Transportable Container, 3 Ton, Truck Mounted. Mod.Instr.No.2. Nov.1981

C 030/9 Shop, Equipment, Instrument Repair, TC, CB 368. Data Summary. Aug.1976

C 031/9 Shop, Equipment, Instrument Repair, TC, CB 368. Operator’s Instructions. Jan.1977

C 032/9 Shop, Equipment, Instrument Repair, TC, CB 368. Field & Base Repairs. Jul.1977

C 038/9 Shop, Equipment, Instrument Repair, TC, CB 368. Part 2. Inspection Standard. Oct.1977

C 037/12 Transportable Container, 3 Ton Truck, Mounted, CB 362, ERV Rapier. Mod.Instr.No.1,2,3,4.

C 037/13 Transportable Container, 3 Ton Truck, Mounted, CB 363,Rapier HORV. Mod.Instr.No.2. May 1976

C 030/15 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 361. Data Summary. Jan.1982

C 031/15 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 361. Operating Instructions. Jun.1982

C 035/15 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 361/0. Inst.Instr.No.1,2,3,4.

C 037/15 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 361. Mod.Instr.No.1,2,3,5,6,7,8.

C 039/15 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 361. Misc.Instr.No. 1.Apr.1982

C 039/21 Shop Equipment, Telecommunications Repair, Truck Mounted, CB 365/2. Misc.Instr.No.1. Apr.1982

C 030/21 Electronic Shop, Control Equipment, Electrical Repair, Truck Mounted, CB365/3. Data summary. Feb.1976

C 038/21 Electronic Shop, Control Equipment, Electrical Repair, Truck Mounted, CB365/3. Part 2. Inspection Standard. Sep.1977

C 039/21 Electronic Shop, Control Equipment, Electrical Repair, Truck Mounted, CB365/3. Misc.Instr.No.1

C 039/23 Shop Equipment, Electronic Repair, Truck Mounted, CB365/5. Misc.Instr.No.1.Apr.1982

C 037/24 Transportable Container, 3 Ton , Truck Mounting, CB370 AIV, AMETS. Mod.Instr.No.1. Aug.1980.

C 037/24 Transportable Container, 3 Ton , Truck Mounting, CB370 AIV, AMETS. Mod.Instr.No.1,2,3,4,5,6,7,9.

C 039/24 Transportable Container, 3 Ton , Truck Mounting, CB370 AIV, AMETS. Misc.Instr.No.2. Sep.1980.

C 037/25 Transportable Container, 3 Ton , Truck Mounting, CB370 AIV, AMETS. Mod.Instr.No.1,2,3,4,5,6.

C 037/30 Transportable Container, 3 Ton , Truck Mounting, CB305 Mk2 (Signals). Mod.Instr.No.1 Nov.1978

 

and in FAESP:

 

2510-C-030-101 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Purpose & Planning Information. Nov.1990

2510-C-030-201 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Operating Information, Nov.1990

2510-C-030-522 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Repair Instructions Chaps 1 to 4.1. Nov.1989

2510-C-030-522 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Repair Instructions Chaps 6-1 to 6-5 & Chap 13. Nov.1989

2510-C-030-532 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Inspection Standard Part 1. Jun.1990

2510-C-030-601 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Maintenance Schedule. Mar 1990

2510-C-030-711 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Illustrated Parts Catalogue Chap 1 to 2.2. Jan.1991

2510-C-030-711 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Illustrated Parts Catalogue Chap 2.3 to 4. Jan.1991

2510-C-030-811 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Mod Instrs 23 to 34. Apr.1991

2510-C-030-811 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Mod Instrs 35 to 44. May 1991

2510-C-030-811 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Mod Instrs 45 to 47. Feb.1991

2510-C-030-821 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Gen Instrs & Index. Instrs 1 to 16. Nov.1988

2510-C-030-821 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Gen Instr 17. Mar.1990

2510-C-030-821 Transportable, Container (CB 300 Series) Gen Instrs 23 to end. Feb.1988

Clive did you just type all that,if you did you deserve a medal.now get back to your g/box:n00b:

A big hello Clive, been a long time since I've seen you.

Thanks for the info. I have just got the MOD 654 back from Withams for the box.

The box has come from 9 Regt AAC Wksp REME and was received into Withams on 08/05/09.

The vehicle asset code is B251502701

The designation is Transportable Container Shop Equipment Electronic Repair Radar 14 Mk1 CB365/13T

Reg No 13TC29.

Date into Service 01/03/77.

I hope this enough information to see if you have anything on this?

Thank you very much for your help,

Andy

Lauren Child,

Thanks for the reply.

Since posting I have had a look at the connectors. The Big round one is marked up "Generator" and has 3 round pins.

The other end is smaller and has 3 round pins (large) and 3 round pins (small), this fits into the input socket. As I haven't got a generator I had to come up with another idea and this is what I did.

Next to the input socket for the generator supply is a normal 240v 3 pin socket. I bought a 40m extension reel (to reach the truck) and then cut a 5' section of cable and put a plug on each end.:stop: DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME IT'S POTENTIALLY LETHAL IF YOU TOUCH THE PINS ON THE PLUG IF YOU HAVE IT PLUGGED INTO THE MAINS BEFORE INSERTING INTO THE BOX SOCKET.

I plugged it into the box socket and switched it on at the mains. Nothing happened at first as I had all the circuit breakers off etc. I switched them on one at a time and hey presto, power!!!:-D

I've tried every item of equipment and all works very well... Both air conditioning units work great, very powerful and cool the box in a few minutes. The heaters also work (all part of the air con units). I only switched one unit on at a time as I didn't want to overload the cable or plugs.

The NBC filtration system also works, another post on this on MV chatter.

All the lights work, even the moon lights.

All in all I'm pretty happy with it so far. Pictures to follow.:cool2:

Hello mate,

I've been digging through some of our old cables and found a few that might come in handy, including one of the weird modified-mains plugs. If you want it it's yours, drop me a pm and i'll put it in a jiffy bag! Some pics of your cable inlets would be good too, I have a load of 3-pin cables that don't fit anything of mine!

Stone

You may find that the round pin connectors are "Commando" EN 60309 connectors, which are normally standard wiring etc. Those are normally associated with high current electrics (like you would see on a generator connection). Depending on the gender of these connectors you should be able to work out if it is supply or outlet.

I would majorly recommend against using the BS1363 UK plug for supply - Aside from the obvious danger using the male plug for supply (i.e. you can touch live conductors), aircon etc. may require substantially more than 13 amps to run.

Commando sockets normally run a 16, 32, or 72 Amps depending on size. The colour normally indicates voltage (blue for 240V, red for 415V, yellow for 110V). Theyre pretty easy to find as they're used a lot in industry, and are pretty easy to wire in (or get wired in).

BS EN 60309 here -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_60309

http://www.hardwarebook.info/IEC_60309

Also it could be a military style connector, like

http://www.aecsinc.com/D38999INSERT.html

http://www.aecsinc.com/D38999.html

They're definitely not commando plugs, I think we all know what they look like!

Obviously they are military connectors (they came from the military...) - they look more like some of the Pattern 105 range by Amphenol but there are literally tens of thousands of green circular connectors with twist-locking mechanisms. I'll see if I can find NSNs on the cables tomorrow, that might help.

I'd mostly like to know what my cables are spec'd for as they might come in useful - and I have equipment with unknown power inlets on. Shame to just bin it, much better if it can come in useful for something...

Stone

Commando sockets normally run a 16, 32, or 72 Amps

Lauren, no such thing as a 72 amp commando socket. The next size up from 32 is 63 amps.

The correct name for these plugs is Ceeform, Commando are ceeform sockets made by the electrical manufacturer MK.

Sorry for being such a pedant. :rolleyes:

Commando sockets normally run a 16, 32, or 72 Amps

 

Lauren, no such thing as a 72 amp commando socket. The next size up from 32 is 63 amps.

The correct name for these plugs is Ceeform, Commando are ceeform sockets made by the electrical manufacturer MK.

Sorry for being such a pedant. :rolleyes:

No worries, and thanks for the update - I dont work with anything over 32 normally

I've attached a pic of the round mains connector (other end terminates to one of the Bakelite-insulated / waterproof BS1363 mains connectors) - this any good to you? For proper safety usage you could lop the BS1363 end off and replace it with a blue EN60309 one as most modern gennies use those, and they seem to be turning into the defacto standard on caravan sites too. The cable's yours for price of postage, just let me know!

Also I'd love to know what the RF connector (other pic) is and where I can get mating parts - I have tons of these cables and they look nice quality. Anyone have any idea of the cable specs, frequency range etc?

Cheers

Stone

Thanks guys.

Stone. That plug is similar to the one I have except mine has male terminals. The other end of the plug is different though. How many amps do you think that cable and plug is designed for, 32?? I was chatting to a guy at Beltring who worked on these in the TA. He told me those black plugs are now illegal and they had to cut their plugs off and fit civvy ones on instead. If that's the case do you think a blue 32amp plug will fit considering the wireing on those cables is muchos thick? Also I'm thinking of buying a 6.5KVA generator to power all the equipment (not at the same time though). I will get one with a 32amp outlet, as well as the 16amp. I've looked on the air con units and can't find any plates telling you what the power requirment is, so I'm guessing 6.5KVA is enough for one unit.

I will take some pictures and put up on here.

Thanks again.

Andy

Thanks guys.

 

If that's the case do you think a blue 32amp plug will fit considering the wireing on those cables is muchos thick? .

 

Thanks again.

 

Andy

Loggy, I just measured a 32a blue plug and each terminal will take a 3.5mm diameter stripped cable.

Loggy, I just measured a 32a blue plug and each terminal will take a 3.5mm diameter stripped cable.

Thanks radiomike.

I do have a spare plug in the truck that I will dig out in a bit. I tried to remove the cable but can't seem to be able to to so. However, it does show the thinkness of the cable.

Thanks mate.

Yeah, the last 32A socket I wired had a rubber boot that you removed when putting the cable together and cut a section out of - it was scored so you could choose the diameter of cable and still get a good waterproof seal. (I would always run a bead of silicone around the edge though, we had one that filled with water overnight and tripped everything!)

He's right about the connectors - think they're made of Bakelite which isn't approved for commercial use any more. No problems for civvies though, as far as I know :cool2:

Most aircons I've seen are 3.5kW or under so I'd expect 6.5kVA to be a reasonable surplus to budget with. Make sure you use an earth spike or you might be in for the odd hair-raising experience! :eek: If you have an RCD in your box it may need earth to be bonded to neutral at the genny end - ask a sparks for advice, or someone on here should know!

Stone

Wow, thats not the connector I was thinking of, but it does look famillar. Does anyone know what that's called?

Here are the pictures of the offending sockets.

Stone, it does have circuit breakers on the main panel (see picture below). There are also earth points inside the box (again look at the photo). There are two earth points and an earth leakage circuit breaker. Question is, which one do I earth? Would I need to earth spike the Generator, AND the earth points at the box? This link goes someway to explaining it, but it's still double dutch to me....

http://www.briggsandstrattongenerators.co.uk/pages/FAQ.htm

Forgot the picture of the power distribution panel.

I'd use an earthing strap to attach Frame Earth (and the other one) to the vehicle chassis, and another strap to attach the generator frame to the vehicle frame. An earth spike ties the generator frame to earth (and thus the vehicle frame as well).

Then start the genny, apply power, flick the MCB switch and press the 'Press to Test' button, if it doesn't trip it's not working! (in which case I'd jumper neutral to earth at the genny, but check with a sparks if it's not sinking in)

Basically what you want to avoid is having the generator running and tied to the vehicle chassis but no connection to the ground - if that happens you can't know what the actual voltage difference between earth and frame is and you'll probably get a shock if you touch it! (the army bods used to do this deliberately to teach interfering NCOs a lesson, when they grabbed the ladder they'd be shocked off it :rofl:)

Looks like my cable is almost the same as yours but not quite - in which case I'd cut the end off and replace it with a civvy one to fit your new genny.

Stone

Maybe Recymech66 can get one of his sparky mates in REME to help us out???:idea::cool2:

Here are the pictures of the offending sockets.

 

That one has some useful linformation on it - It's a Bendix made connector (now part of Amphenol, who are the name in a lot of the military style circular connectors) 2822 probably relates to this insert. I would have thought if you send Amphenol support a copy of the pic they would identify the connector, and it's probably available through the likes of digi-key.

http://www.amphenol.co.uk/

http://uk.digikey.com/

Looking at this website -

http://www.aecsinc.com/Catalog1.pdf

MIL-DTL-5015 has a 2822 insert.

and http://www.amphenol-aerospace.com/catalogs/12-025/lo/12-025.pdf

shows a 28-22 type in the AC range

Blimey, that is well over my head.... You need a sparky just to look at the website's,lol...:shocked:

Maybe Recymech66 can get one of his sparky mates in REME to help us out???:idea::cool2:

I'll print off your original question and give it one of the techs tomorrow, I aint even going to try and relay it myself lol.:sweat:

I'll print off your original question and give it one of the techs tomorrow, I aint even going to try and relay it myself lol.:sweat:

Sent PM mate.:-D